POST 1912 DATESTAMP INQUIRIES - ASK QUESTIONS HERE !!

[Ross Ewington]

Rather than have individual topics created for general inquiries about post 1912 datestamps/postmarks,
it may be more "economical" to use a single thread.

...and to start the ball rolling .... a first inquiry

Has anyone seen this datestamp before?

launceston square pmk 1920.jpg (107.06 KiB) Viewed 327031 times

LAUNCESTON / 20 FEB 1920 / TASMANIA

This light impression is on a 6d TAS Postal Note and has only just come to light.

[John Hardinge]

Ross, yes I have seen this before. It is exceedingly rare. Only two copies known, both from forms. This is a new late date.

[Ross Ewington]

In both editions of Avery & Hardinge as well as the "update" in The Courier No.31" (2001),
the cds used at DOUGLAS RIVER (1934 and 1959 - ERD and LRD respectively) is classified as being a Type 4a.

This example of the datestamp on an entire from the "Met Bureau Hoard" appears to be a Type 4, i.e. no stop after TAS.

Is there an error that has continued through all listings or something else? The thin clear appearance of the
lettering on the datestamp does suggest Type 4a but there ain't no stop.

douglas river 4.jpg (8.6 KiB) Viewed 327007 times

[Ross Ewington]

While sorting through an estate lot today I came across a dealer's small approval book of
ancient origin with this HOBART TASMANIA handstamp applied front and reverse. I can
just make out a dateline and it does look "familiar". Could this be a Hobart GPO datestamp
that may have been "requisitioned" for private use?

[Ross Ewington]

Both of these LAUNCESTON datestamps are on telegram forms.

I think this is Type R2a(vi)... the diameter is 37mm
[attachment=1]launceston tgm cancel 2.jpg[/attachment]
Can anyone confirm or inform please?

...also... this datestamp is Type R2a but which one or is it 'new'?? (remembering
that's it's a telegram cancel and not a postmark unless some postal use is
known of course)
[attachment=0]launceston tgm cancel 1.jpg[/attachment]
It's diameter is only 28mm

[david adams]

I have what looks very much like a "Scamander Upper" CDS on a 1d Roo.
The CDS is Type 2a and only partial, but the date is definitely 1914 and looks like March. The "Upper" is clear but the "ANDER" of "Scamander" (if it is) is somewhat light although the "R" is very clear. I use a red filter. I know the period does not fit in with the post office opening times etc. and I have used the Premier reference site for all states and the only hit is "Scamander Upper".
[attachment=0]adams postmark inquiry.jpg[/attachment]

Any views please.

[John Hardinge]

It's Calder Upper David. Can be quite hard to find

[josto]

Hi!

Can anyone tell me if this postmark is rated somehow? It is Murdunna 2. Aug. 1918 on a Cover to the USA with two 1d KGV heads and one 1/2d KGV head.



Thanks a lot

[Ross Ewington]

Murdunna Type 2 is rated (R)RRR on Tasmanian pictorial stamps [see http://tps.org.au/bb/viewtopic.php?f=9& ... rt=20#p285 ]
but as it was in use until 1964, on Australian issues, it is quite common from 1913. A cover with KGV defins mailed at Murdunna is really nice .....pity it's not registered.

[jimjamtwo]

Here's two items with Tasmanian violet ink cancels that I haven't been able to identify.

The first (2d Jubilee) starts with 'SPR,' so would be either Spreyton or Springs.

The second (the KGV head) starts with 'W' and could be 'WAR,' but that's all I can make out.

If the placename does start with 'WAR,' the contenders are Waratah, Warrane, Warrentinna, and Warringa.

Interestingly, the two digits for the year seem to be inverted; when viewed the right way up, they appear to read '32.

Any help in identifying these cancels would be greatly appreciated.

[admin]

The "SPR" fragment is Spreyton for my money. Sprent is a Type 2, as is Springs, so the date will be on 1 line only. Spreyton is also recorded in violet ink between '35 and '36 by Hardinge so that probably confirms it.
Cant figure the other item at this stage but will see what I can uncover.

Pete

[jimjamtwo]

Thanks for the response, Pete.

Here are two more that have caught my attention. The first, which ends in 'VE,' has a rather elaborate design feature - something like tendrils - instead of an arc after the placename. Or is this simply ink mess, for want of a better term?

The second one (--- 'NAH'?) has a rather chunky block instead of an arc, which seems distinctive. Is there a shape inside the block, or is the white space here an accident?

Does anyone know what they are?

[admin]

As a start, post offices ending in "VE" could include:
Norwood Ave, Bellerive, Oyster Cove, Little Oyster Cove, Grove, Wattle Grove, Vinegrove.
Offices ending in NAH, if thats what it is, could include Tonganah, Tunganah, Trenah, Tungatinah, Wayatinah, Rialannah, Alonnah, Oonah and Moonah.
A little research in Avery and Hardinge will soon show which officers were open at the time, which will limit the field a bit. A process of elimination by Post Mark type may further limit the field or provide an answer
I'm not sure about the ink mess on the "VE" but the square block on the "NAH" could be the block which contains the AM or PM on a type 3 - date and time all on 1 line. Apparently this was sometimes blocked out for smaller Offices, or perhaps you can distinguish the AM or PM ?. It definitely looks like part of the datestamp to me. Others with more experience than I may have a better idea. I'm not sure beyond that.

[jimjamtwo]

Thanks for the suggestions, Pete.

I think the first name is most likely to be a short one, so GROVE would seem the best contender. (It would also be symmetrical.) If anyone has a clearer Grove datestamp, I'd be most interested in seeing what it looks like.

The second one is MOONAH. I found I had a complete Moonah cancel. It's a real mess, but I was able to see that it has the same block.

[admin]

You may be right about Moonah - it was a type 3 at this time so the block would be there, but being a bigger office, most likely has a PM or AM within although its not clear in your example.
Again Grove was a type 2 during the time frame , so it looks right from that point of view .

Heres a scan Someone may have a better one. Its a common postmark.
Given the pointy taper on the middle arm of the "E" I'd say its Grove alright?

grove013.jpg (39.09 KiB) Viewed 326147 times

grove-closeup3.jpg (16.94 KiB) Viewed 326147 times

[jimjamtwo]

Thanks, Pete. Those two look sorted now!

This one should be easy but I can't work it out. Something BRIDGE:

[admin]

While there are quite a few "bridges" theres only one preceded by an "E" where the name is two seperate words - Dee Bridge, and its a type 1 so it fits. Thats my guess anyway.

[jimjamtwo]

Thanks so much, Pete! I thought it might be an easy one for people who know Tasmanian locations. I couldn't think of a single location with such a name myself and, as you can imagine, Google isn't very helpful when it comes to placenames that include such common words as 'Bridge.' For this reason, many of the postmarks I have been unable to identify are locations ending in words like 'CLIFF' and 'ROCKS.'

[admin]

Glad I could help.

[jimjamtwo]

Pete, I forgot to ask before: do they give a rarity rating for the Spreyton violet cancel?

[admin]

James,
Spreyton is not rated regardless of colour. Its quite common I am afraid. Dee Bridge is rated R for the type I, but really most collectors will want to see at least the best part of the Town Name to make it a collectable strike. A few letters only is not really up to the usual minimum standard. If you dont have a copy of Avery & Hardinge "Tasmania Cancellations 1913 - 88" Part 1 and 2, then you may find it very useful. All Tas Commonwealth postmarks up to 1988 are listed including some suspected but not seen, along with full rarity ratings and various notes. Its where I get most of my information. Its well out of print but Prestige Philately may have copies or you might pick them up from a stamp shop etc.
Pete

[jimjamtwo]

Thanks for the comments, Pete. I think if the violet cancel was only in use in 1935-36, it probably is relatively uncommon, if not rare. Have you seen one before?

Moving along: I have a feeling this one is a Tasmanian cancel. Any idea if there's a location in Tassie with 'TURA(Y?)' in the placename?

[Ross Ewington]

I forgot to ask before: do they give a rarity rating for the Spreyton violet cancel?

Postmarks in colours other than black are not rated by Avery & Hardinge but when known are listed as 'interesting' in the remarks column.

This online forum is the ideal place to report "anything different" as new information will be transferred from here to the current version of "The List".

[jimjamtwo]

Thanks for the info, Ross.

I have seen an auction for a Tasmanian violet ink cancel that went very high indeed (three figures, I recall), so when I found the two mentioned above I laid them aside for further investigation.

By the way, the cancel above turns out not to be Tasmanian at all - it's Tatura (Victoria). Sorry about that!

[Ross Ewington]

I have seen an auction for a Tasmanian violet ink cancel that went very high indeed (three figures, I recall)

Can you recall the town name or the name of the auction house? It is unlikely that the colour of the ink would affect the price realised all that much ...the postmark must have been RRRR or RRRRR to start with. The only exceptions I can think of where the colour of the ink can make a big difference is in regard to some PAID cds postmarks in the early 1950s ... but that is a very specialised field indeed with very few collectors.